bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Sam 01 Mars 2008 15:29

I shall update the existing french translations as soon as necessary.
Go on with the good work, Thyme :D

I recently added a few of your Vrml tutorials, in french, about things never really explained before such as shared events, events by chat ("enge start" or "enge stop" :P ) add and remove objects ...

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/matthieu/page_seamless3d.htm

( en français : je viens de traduire "ajouter et enlever un objet" )
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Ven 07 Mars 2008 19:06

(je continue mes traductions, consultez la page Thyme de Matthieu)
... en attendant et à titre exceptionnel, regardez notre petite Petra en pleine course à pied (il faut la cliquer) une oeuvre de Griff et Thyme.

http://perso.orange.fr/Matthieu/Seamles ... se2run.wrl

Note importante : ce modèle est déjà assez ancien (2005) et, comme le fait remarquer Thyme ci-après, il est possible d'obtenir une représentation beaucoup plus lisse et réaliste avec le logiciel Seamless3d tel qu'il est présenté actuellement ( version 2.131). A l'époque c'était un modèle BVH et il avait été d'abord importé puis ultra simplifié par Griff avant sa conversion en Vrml. Je le laisse ici malgré tout, il est un exemple de ce qu'il est possible de faire en matière d'avatar, même si l'on peut faire beaucoup mieux encore maintenant.
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Sam 08 Mars 2008 1:38

Hi Matthieu :)
Have you imported any bvh files yet using the new bvh import feature?
In comparison to the bvh imports I have tried using the new Seamless, this Petra animation looks very simplistic and un-lifelike even with the imported bvh files being left with the simple segmented geometry. I assume this is because Griff converted only a very limited number of key frames from the bvh file and so most of the lifelike quality was lost. The reason for such a drastic reduction may have been to do with the difficulty of converting it to VRML but this should no longer be a problem now that seamless can do it all. The imported animation can be applied to any avatar so long as the pivot point positions are a close enough match. The size or scale should not matter if the ratio is maintained.
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Sam 08 Mars 2008 17:48

... avant de traduire le long message de Thyme ci-dessus :
BVH Import, ModelMorpher, Easier Textures & More For 2.130
( viewtopic.php?f=54&t=1604 )
je me suis appliqué à traduire les trois didacticiels cités, importation de fichiers BVH, "morphing" des modèles pour leur animation, et Application de textures, que l'on trouvera comme d'hab sur la page de Thyme du site de Matthieu :

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/matthieu/page_seamless3d.htm

ah, au fait, oui ! on en est à 2.131
Thyme, le magicien qui compte plus vite que son nombre :O)))
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Lun 10 Mars 2008 3:01

Thanks so very much Dear Matthieu, you work tirelessly in parallel while I mess about with my own problems :mrgreen:
I have notified the Seamless3d forum of you translations which I am sure will be much appreciated :P
I have also put a reference back to this thread on this forum so that others can catch your announcements as they happen.
Sorry for the delay replying back, I recently had a mini crisis with the seamless3d forum not working correctly but I have fixed this now :laugh:
I am truly grateful of your support
kindest of regards
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Mer 12 Mars 2008 15:56

deux avatars de Thyme (ce sont des robots didacticiels) sont animés sur la page "Thyme" de Matthieu, voir les items 19 et 21 :

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/matthieu/page_seamless3d.htm
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Mer 12 Mars 2008 22:34

Good to see the animations Matthieu for the "immediate av" and the "build av" tutorials :)
I wonder if we should just call "immediate editing" "blue part" editing since this has become a more commonly used term since the introduction of the blue part.
This term seems less awkward and explains what it is very directly. The only problem I see is the possible ambiguity of confusing the colour of the icon with the color of the geometry if when referring to a "blue part". I can see this problem being very real but "blue part editing" just feels easier and its less geeky :)

"Order of priortes thread (What I did today) a écrit:Yesterday I converted the Immediate avatar demo to use the new pivotPoint field. I have also made the old horizontal pivot point buttons simply adjust the pivotPoint field for the selected part. Perhaps these buttons are now obsolete but I can see by being on the tool bar they let the user move the pivot points without the control panel open. This has the advantage of allowing the user to have more 3d scene visible (which is one of the advantages of blue part editing).
I have also made the "average selected part's vertices to create pivot point location" work for the new pivot point field.
For blue part editing the old way using translations for each part was not cumbersome for the user like it was when using white parts and so I have questioned why change everything from the old way to the new pivotPoint way since both ways can work in harmony but since I don't think there is any real difference in performance and the pivotPoint way works just as well for blue part editing as it does for white part editing and the new way does offer a little more versatility even for blue part editing (allows you to have a position interpolator offset from the centre of the pelvis), I prefer to use just the new way in favour of the old way to keep concepts simple. (too many options available to the beginner can lead to confusion and more tutorials would have to be written)
The old way will however remain supported by seamless in that it will continue to work and the user will be able to convert from translations to pivotPoints and back the other way using a menu command and if the old way proves to have some significant advantage for editing I can always bring it back to have all of the editing support it use to have.

Today I hope to complete the rewrite for the build an av demo (I have significantly simplified this demo by using the new features and using a more intuitive approach to making an avatar)
Also I want to change the animated worm demo to use the pivotPoints but this will be trivial to do and so the demos will be completed by the end of today I am hoping.


Don't bother translating all this waffle I quoted from my self, its more for you than any one else Matthieu :)
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Jeu 13 Mars 2008 9:53

Hi Thyme !

I think I shall faithfully translate the tutorials, and somewhat quote in short french your own "waffle" :) because it is always useful to know.
About "immediate" : this is a french word, as are so many in english, but its meaning changed a lot since it crossed the channel. It means now in french "right now" and no longer "without any go between" that is why I translated "immediate editing" by "modelage direct". Think about a potter making a pot from clay.

as I get a more detailed feeling of Seamless3d, I come back to my translations to improve the french version.
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Dim 16 Mars 2008 9:32

Voilà c'est paru:
Simplified Build Av Demo & Important Bug Fix for 2.132
( viewtopic.php?f=54&t=1606 )
Bravo ... et je me retrouve avec un grand pain tout neuf sur la planche :P

En attendant, et après avoir pris conseil de Thyme, j'ai ajouté une note à "Cap sur l'animation" et à Exporter en wrl un fichier Seamless3d, puis proposé à ceux que ça intéresse de voir la scène et de voir le code.
Le problème à surmonter tient à l'exportation des modèles animés de SMLS vers WRL. Le Proto n'est pas vraiment fonctionnel, le touchSensor ne marche pas. Thyme promet d'y revenir dès qu'il aura le temps.
Il y a quelques "légères" modifications à apporter dans le code WRL pour que tout se passe bien, vous verrez ça dès maintenant sur la "Page de Thyme" de Matthieu, naturellement:

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/matthieu/page_seamless3d.htm
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Dim 16 Mars 2008 16:52

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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Mar 18 Mars 2008 15:55

Today I looked more into this Issue you raised Matthieu in regard to a TouchSensor not working if an Avatar proto is output (an Avatar proto is output automatically when the scene contains a gesture group) .
I found the TouchSensor works fine if it is added immediately in-front of the Seamless node (as a sibling) for contact but fails if added after it.
If I put all of the nodes inside a single group node (including the TouchSensor) all works fine for the proto. A group node can be added using seamless3d but I am not exactly sure why of if this should need to be done. Octaga does not need a Group node added nor does it matter with Octaga if the TouchSensor is before or after the geometry but since Contact is the first browser I target I will make it so seamless automatically puts all of the nodes in the scene inside a group node when ever an Avatar proto is output. I find Cortona also benefits from a Group node being added.

Thanks for testing Seamless Matthieu and all your help :P
Best wishes
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Lun 24 Mars 2008 12:16

importation des avatars d'Avatar Studio 1 et 2

une traduction? mais c'est bien sûr, il suffit de consulter :P :

http://perso.orange.fr/Matthieu/Seamles ... _AVS2.html

et en plus, le TouchSensor est arrangé.

(que l'on trouve sur la page "Thyme" de Matthieu)

(et aussi, le didacticiel complet sera traduit "real soon now" :mrgreen: )
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Lun 24 Mars 2008 15:05

Thanks Matthieu :)
I will get some of the other tutorials updated very soon for the demos that have been recently modified but I am currently excited by the equally important task of replacing the branch join av demo with a demo that shows how to make a "seamless" version of the simple build_av.smls av using nubs patches and the new Fuse node which I have not yet talked about in any detail. It will be the first demo/tutorial that will show how to make a complete animated av using build nodes to make smooth joins. I am hopeful this can be done by the end of the week but it is hard to predict at this stage because it will involve adding a new feature to the Stem node to bypass the need to use any transfer vertex type nodes (simular to how the RingBuild node can allocate ownership to multiple parts) . I wont let this demo take a very long time however because the whole idea is to keep it as close to the simplicity of the build av demo as possible.
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar Matthieu » Lun 24 Mars 2008 17:02

ceci dit ... le didacticiel complet d'import des avatars figure AUSSI dans la page Thyme de Matthieu :

http://perso.orange.fr/Matthieu/Seamles ... _1et2.html

(pour la minute, tout va bien, j'arrive à suivre ... :mrgreen: )
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Re: bonnes nouvelles de Thyme

Messagepar thyme » Mer 02 Avr 2008 15:48

Thanks again Matthieu :mrgreen:

I have given up on the idea (at least for now) of making the stem node be able to give ownership to multiple parts because I found there was a problem with this idea when mirroring the arm (the leg will have the same problem). The problem is part of the arm gets owned by the torso and so how does this part of the arm get copied to the other side without duplicating the other vertices in the torso. I did come up with some ideas like adding a specialised CopyPart node for this task that plugs into the Stem node but since my lovely simple idea has grown in complexity and I don't like the idea of making the stem node any more complex than it already is I have decided to stick to what I know works well, that is transfer the vertices at a later stage using a sequence of TransferVertex nodes.

Image

This picture shows where the seamless robot is up to in making the new nurbs patch av.
The robot takes a little under 12 min to get this far which I find exciting considering this time includes setting up the skeleton of parts.
This avatar is designed to be simple and easy for nurbs but it should be possible to make endless variations for this basic shape, it should also serve as a base for making a more complex nurbs patch avs.

As the picture shows it is made from only 3 nurbs patches.

What I have left to do is:

    Color it.
    Optimise the rings of vertices and make the rings dense for the joints.
    Move the pivot points
    Transfer the owner ship to all the appropriate parts.
    At this stage it can be animated but I am going to continue (as an option) to show how to make the arms and legs join on more smoothly by fusing the surfaces together.
    Later as a more advanced option again (not completely necessary) I am going to show how to edit the vertices at the flat stage to make the arms and legs join more neatlyto the torso but I may leave this option till another version.

I was hoping to take things easy from now on but as usual there always seems to be a big rush to get the next version ready.
The crisis brewing now is the fact that the blaxxun site has not been online for more than 2 weeks and so I want to at least fix the seamless multi user chat server which I broke a few years ago when I added the new windows.
Just to do this I hope it should not take more than a few days but I dont want to start untill I have the new nurbs av demo ready which I hope will take just a few more days.
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